Showing posts with label Hannover-Hargis. Show all posts
Showing posts with label Hannover-Hargis. Show all posts

Friday, January 22, 2021

Jewish Burial Law and Exhumation of Mass Graves

Over at the cesspit, our old friend Hannover tends to repeat himself a fair bit. One of his "greatest hits" is the claim that the idea that Jewish law generally forbids the exhumation of mass graves is a ruse designed to hide the "fact" that there are, in reality, no mass graves. Most recently, the Sage of CODOH wrote, "That [the idea that that Jewish law forbides exhumation] is a lie and has always been a way to dodge the fact that there are NO excavations which show the alleged millions upon millions of Jew human remains claimed to be located in know [sic] locations."

Putting aside for the moment that mass graves have been demonstrated time and again, it's worth considering what Jewish law actually has to say about these things. It's been nearly a decade since we've discussed the matter, and maybe it's time to get a little more specific.

There are two Talmudic texts of the topic. These quotations are taken from the William Davidson Talmud, which is provided online at sefaria.org.

Bava Batra 154a
Rabbi Yoḥanan raised an objection to Rabbi Shimon ben Lakish from a baraita: There was an incident in Bnei Brak involving one who sold some of his father’s property that he had inherited, and he died, and the members of his family came and contested the sale, saying: He was a minor at the time of his death, and therefore the sale was not valid. And they came and asked Rabbi Akiva: What is the halakha? Is it permitted to exhume the corpse in order to examine it and ascertain whether or not the heir was a minor at the time of his death? Rabbi Akiva said to them: It is not permitted for you to disgrace him for the sake of a monetary claim. And furthermore, signs indicating puberty are likely to change after death, and therefore nothing can be proved by exhuming the body.

Yevamot 63b
Apropos the Ḥabbarim, the Gemara cites the following statement of the Sages: The Ḥabbarim were able to issue decrees against the Jewish people with regard to three matters, due to three transgressions on the part of the Jewish people. They decreed against meat, i.e., they banned ritual slaughter, due to the failure of the Jewish people to give the priests the gifts of the foreleg, the jaw, and the maw. They decreed against Jews bathing in bathhouses, due to their neglect of ritual immersion. Third, they exhumed the dead from their graves because the Jews rejoice on the holidays of the gentiles, as it is stated: “Then shall the hand of the Lord be against you and against your fathers” (I Samuel 12:15). Rabba bar Shmuel said: This verse is referring to exhuming the dead, which upsets both the living and the dead, as the Master said: Due to the iniquity of the living, the dead are exhumed.

More authoritative is the Shulchan Aruch (also available at sefaria.org), the 17th century compendium of Jewish law considered authoritative for eastern European Jewry.

Shulchan Aruch, Yoreh De'ah, 363
One should not remove a corpse and bones[1] from a dignified grave to [another] dignified grave, nor from an undignified grave to [another] undignified grave, nor from an undignified one to a dignified one, and needless to say [that it is forbidden] from a dignified one to an undignified one. 

[1] Two reasons are advanced for this prohibition: a) The disturbance of removal is hard on the dead — TaZ, ShaK. Cf. I Sam. XXVIII, 15; Job III, 13; b) Removal is considered a disrespectful treatment of the dead — RIDBaZ to Yad, Ebel XIV, 15. One who was buried in a non-Jewish cemetery may be removed to a Jewish one — P.Tesh., G.Mah. 

Two possibilities emerge here. The first is that international Jewry, cognizant of the grand hoax to be perpetrated some 1,500 years in the future, conspired to draft pages of Talmud to which Rabbi Yosef Karo could refer some 1,100 years later when compiling an index of Jewish law for the masses of Ashkenazim.

The second possibility is that Jewish law actually does have something to say about the topic.

Let's be clear: We are under no illusions here that the folks over at CODOH will stop lying just because this blog post has appeared. However, with any luck, people curious to know whether their claims have any merit will find this post. That, after all, is sort of the point of what we're doing here.

Saturday, April 11, 2020

The Number of Jews in Europe on the Eve of the Holocaust

Somebody requested in a Holocaust denial forum on my blog article Seriously Now, Where Did The Jews "Evacuated to The East" Go? that "the issue of these transported Jews" shall be "addressed correctly and precisely" by deniers. Brilliant idea! But also pretty naive - we are not calling that place "the cesspit" for nothing. Readily illustrated by the emoderator "Hannover" with his nervous attempt of damage control. High spam factor, little relevance and zero impact on the issue at the hand.

The deniers Graf, Mattogno and Kues? Already addressed in the same blog posting.

Babi Yar? A well documented Nazi massacre.

Jews in labour camps west of Treblinka and "Jews evacuated to USSR during war" prior Nazi occupation? Does not deal with the fate of unfit Jews "evacuated to the East" during Nazi occupation.

"1,250,000 – 1,500,000 Polish Jews homeless in Europe" (although carelessly attributed to Polish Jews in a letter by Stephen Wise, the figure actually refers to all Jews outside the Soviet Union) and an "Influx of 3,000,000 JEWS" after the war? That's from the same bag of denier's trick and ignores that a figure of 3 - 4 million Jews in Europe after the war is the order of magnitude expected after the decimation of 5-6 million anyway. It does not help to explain away the Jewish losses during the war. But let's have a closer look at this one.

How many Jews had there been on the eve of the mass extermination of Jews in continental Europe (i.e., always without Great-Britain)? Let's start with how many Jews the Nazis estimated had been in Europe. This is complemented by estimations after the war as well a more recent monograph on Holocaust demographics.

Monday, May 01, 2017

What the CODOHites are saying when they think nobody is watching.

Remember how CODOH is supposed all to be about rationality, arguments and no hidden agenda whatsoever?

Except they used to have this hidden subforum called VIP Lounge, accessible only to the "time honored & trusted Revisionists", to quote Jonnie "Hannover" Hargis.

Well, here's what they really write when they think the Traditional Enemy is not watching.



Tuesday, April 04, 2017

137 Crushed Lies, or Why Denial Is Beyond Repair

The average online denier is not a sophisticated creature. He is usually satisfied with a few memes he has found on Twitter or at some forum and repeats them ad infinitum, never bothering to fact-check them, thus regurgitating the deceptive tidbits that have been debunked over and over and over again. One such moldy debunked meme is the myth about the crushed testicles of 137 German defendants in the Dachau trials.

From David Irving's site:
All but two of the Germans, in the 139 cases we investigated, had been kicked in the testicles beyond repair. This was Standard Operating Procedure with American investigators.
The source is given as "The Progressive, February 1949, p. 21f", the author is alleged to be Edward L. Van Roden:
a Pennsylvania judge served in World War I and II, in the latter as Chief of the Military Justice Division for the European Theater where he saw service in Normandy, Belgium, the Rhineland, the Battle of the Bulge, and in the Ardennes. In 1946 he was reassigned to active duty and served on several important court martial trials in Germany. In 1948 Secretary of the Army Royall appointed him to an extraordinary commission charged with investigating the Dachau War Crimes program.
So of course this is repeated ad nauseam on Twitter and at trashy forums like CODOH, where this is a favorite of its know-nothing Aufseher Jonnie "Hannover" Hargis.

Sunday, August 21, 2016

CODOH and the Fake Auschwitz Records

The alleged Official German Records of Prisoners in Auschwitz in Auschwitz Concentration Camp May 1940 Through December 1944 fabricated by the notorious forger Peter Stahl have been just rediscovered as "another nail in the 'holocaust' storyline coffin" by the CODOH Moderator Hannover despite that he had been present when it was exposed some years ago in his own forum.

Since he also wanted to delete and censor the thread 'Killing' of Jews in Auschwitz (Kinna report) because it supposedly "was mere repetition of previously worked over material" while it had actually not been discussed before in this place, can anyone still active over there please suggest him an Alzheimer treatment? Or at least ask for his replacement. Reposting fraudelent sources and attempting to ban new material and discussion is not funny anymore.

Friday, August 05, 2016

Denier Excuses For Their Epic Fail

After witnessing the latest display of passive-aggressive infantilism from our old friend Hannover on this thread at CODOH forum, I was reminded of this little list of denier excuses, compiled many years ago on the old RODOH forum.

Saturday, August 01, 2015

Tattoo Denial

When the usual methodological and historical ignorance characteristic of Holocaust denial gets further reduced to virtual complete historical ignorance and meets some more spitefulness, you get Tattoo Denial. It denies or - in its slightly less silly variant - doubts that Jewish and Soviet prisoners were crudely tattooed their prisoner number in Auschwitz. It's main advocate used to be Carlos Porter, a number of sceptic species can observed right now in the CODOH thread Doubts about Tattoos by the book author Nick Kollerstrom (by the way, the CODOH moderator Hannover delivers a particular thrilling performance in this thread when he reveals that his attention span is less than it takes to read and grasp a single book page). The failure of most Holocaust deniers in this thread to spot some historical truth related to the Holocaust even when its right infront of them says volumes about how defective and irrational the methods, arguments and concepts of this movement are also in general and how common sense is lacking or completely masked by ideological beliefs.

I attach seven German sources on the tattooing of Jewish and Soviet prisoners by the Germans to this posting:
  • three testimonies of former Auschwitz SS men (Pery Broad, Wihelm Boger, Hans Stark) of the Political Department, whose admission office was responsible for the tattooing of prisoners 
  • four contemporary German document: two orders by the German Armed Force High Command to mark Soviets POWs and two reports on the escape of Auschwitz prisoners with tattooed prisoner numbers

Tuesday, July 07, 2015

Playing Whack-a-Mole With Jonnie Hargis

[The following is a contribution from Andrew E. Mathis.]

In the past few months, Jonnie "Hannover" Hargis has ventured outside the confines of his CODOH cesspit to debate the finer points of race and economics at Unz.com -- as well as to drive traffic (he hopes) to his vanity Web site. As can be seen below, Jonnie is currently posting at Unz under the name "BobbyBeGood":

http://www.unz.com/comments/commenter/BobbyBeGood

Fans of Mr. Hargis and/or of this blog will recognize the characteristic style.

Thursday, June 04, 2015

The Antisemitism of Jonnie Hargis

Writing as Breker here:
Jews have reaped what they have sown time & time again. And true to form, Jews have historically lied and exaggerated the reactions against their behavior while ignoring their own responsibility.
And that was the case with National Socialist Germany. To the NSDAP the only realistic solution was removal of the offending group, hence the relocation of Jews to parts of eastern Europe during WII; which was meant as a temporary solution until war's end and a more definitive answer could be arrived at. Instead of sober self evaluation, what did Jews do? They invented the infamous fraud of "the Holocaust".

Thursday, May 21, 2015

CODOH Latest: Hubris, Hannover's Stupidity

1) Hubris - seen in this thread in a) the idea that denial deserves educational parity with history, as if Flat Earth beliefs and spiritualism deserve parity with physics (genuine physics that is, not denier junk science); b) the belief that an Internet site promoting petitions should give space to a petition with an antisemitic agenda. The petition's author, Kollerstrom, could simply have checked out the site's terms of service: 
We reserve the right to remove petitions found to be excessively offensive by our users or editorial staff

2) Hannover's stupidity, arrogance, dishonesty, immorality - seen here, thread preserved here.

Saturday, April 25, 2015

Atrocity by Soviet Partisans in Finnish Lapland (extremely graphic)

This page shows in graphic detail an atrocity committed by Soviet partisans who crossed the border into Finnish Lapland in 1944. The photos undoubtedly document an act of terrorism, which can be fairly classed as murder, with documented child victims. However, contrary to the mad ravings of the not-very-bright Jonnie Hargis, these photos were suppressed for six decades not by Zionists but by Finns, as shown here, because atrocities committed by both sides were too sensitive a topic to air publicly during the Cold War. Details of the events have been on-line for over a decade and can be found, for example, here and here. Horrific crimes by the Finns included mass starvation and shooting, such as shown here.

What these crimes show is something that should be obvious but which we occasionally have to restate: atrocities occurred in many places in World War II, committed by many sides, but those by the Nazis in the USSR were on a far larger scale, based upon systematic pre-invasion starvation and shooting planning, and designed to make vastly wider spaces available only to German settlement.

Wednesday, May 14, 2014

"The Tide is Turning"

It seems in recent years that deniers have increasingly proclaimed victory and congratulated themselves for... well, nothing.

They like to trumpet an increasing skepticism towards the Holocaust as an indication of their success. Nearly a decade ago Robert Faurisson clamored that a "serious calling into question of one of the greatest lies in history" was underway, and that in the West the "the scales are falling off some people's eyes." The moderator of the CODOH Revisionist Forum, Jonnie "Hannover" Hargis, has declared that the "tide is turning" nearly three hundred times in the last year, nearly once a day.

The problem with all of this? The tide is not turning for them, as shown by the recent ADL global antisemitism survey.

Sunday, May 04, 2014

Three Hitler Speeches from 1942

January 30, 1942 [Domarus, p.2574]
We are fully aware that this war can end either in the extermination of the Aryan people or in the disappearance of Jewry from Europe. I said as much before the German Reichstag on September 1, 1939. I wish to avoid making hasty prophesies, but this war will not end as the Jews imagine, namely, in the extermination of the European-Aryan people; instead, the result of this war will be the annihilation of Jewry. For the first time, the old, truly Jewish rule of “an eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth,” will obtain.  

Tuesday, July 31, 2012

Reconstructing "A message to Jonnie Hannover Hargis ..." (2)

Reconstructing "A message to Jonnie Hannover Hargis ..." (1)

In the previous blog of this series, I reproduced posts nos. 1 to 7 from the extinct RODOH forum’s thread "A message to Jonnie Hannover Hargis ...".

In this blog I reproduce posts # 8 to # 10 from that thread. These posts dealt with matters related to corpse cremation at the Auschwitz-Birkenau concentration and extermination camp.

Friday, June 22, 2012

Wednesday, June 13, 2012

Reconstructing "A message to Jonnie Hannover Hargis ..." (1)

The extinct RODOH forum's most visited thread, "A message to Jonnie Hannover Hargis ...", was being reconstructed on the RODOH 2 forum.

As that forum was also deleted, a partial reconstruction will be done in several blogs, starting with this one, mostly by inserting the screenshots from the original RODOH thread "A message to Jonnie Hannover Hargis ..." as images, which can be enlarged to a readable size by clicking on them and viewed in slideshow sequence. Where posts considered of interest are available in MS Word format, the text of such posts will also be transcribed in blog format, after some editing to replace German special letters and punctuation marks that got lost in the original RODOH forum's migration to Yuku. Spelling errors will also be corrected, and bare links converted into embedded links, but otherwise the text reproduced will be the same that was posted on the RODOH forum, as can be verified on hand of the corresponding screenshots. Red letters highlight the posts’ sequential numbers on the thread as well as links that were lost when the RODOH forum was deleted.

Saturday, January 28, 2012

Thomas Kues on recent archaeological finds at Treblinka

It comes as no surprise that "Revisionist" coryphée Thomas Kues tries to explain the recent finds of Caroline Sturdy Colls at the site of Treblinka extermination camp in accordance with his "Revisionist" theories.